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 Post subject: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:48 am 
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Two months to go. Who will you be voting for?

Latest poll shows we could be heading for another hung parliament - link.

A Labour/Scottish National Party coalition government is a possibility, even if the Conservatives win the most seats, and even if they teamed up with the Lib Dems, who's forecast is looking pretty miserable it has to be said. Despite the hype UKIP are looking at 1 to 4 seats tops.

Also we need a new voting system.

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 1:59 pm 
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Yup.

Got to get rid of "First Past the Post".

And this year, I shall probably be voting: UKIP.

Mostly on the basis of wanting to shake things up; but also because Mr. Farage is the only leader of a National Party talking sense on a couple of important issues:

Quote:
UKIP leader Nigel Farage has stepped up his criticism of EU foreign policy for destabilising countries on Europe’s doorstep and further afield.

Mr Farage said: “We are seeing vanity take the place of reason in foreign policy and the result is to destabilise a whole series of countries to no positive effect that I can discern. It is not just the Ukraine.

“The civil war in Syria was made worse by EU leaders stoking the expectation of western forces helping to topple the Assad dictatorship despite the increasing dominance of militant Islamists in the rebellion.

“In the case of the Ukraine, Brussels has for many years been feeding an entirely unrealistic dream of a future as an EU member state and large net recipient of funds.

“This has encouraged brave young men and women in western Ukraine to rebel to the point of toppling a legitimate president and led to the utterly predictable debacle whereby Vladimir Putin has annexed part of the country and now casts a long shadow over hopes of genuine democracy in the rest of it.

“I do not support what Putin has done – of course I don’t. But the approach of David Cameron, William Hague, Nick Clegg and other EU leaders has been disastrous. If you poke the Russian bear with a stick he will respond. And if you have neither the means nor the political will to face him down that is very obviously not a good idea.”


- http://www.ukip.org/nigel_farage_steps_ ... ign_policy

And:

Quote:
At Castle Point in Essex, where Ukip candidate Jamie Huntman is currently standing, Farage said the current system made us “victims of our own economy”, and that we are living under a “lethal combination of big government, big banks and big business”.

“We are now living in a corporate economy,” he said. “We are living in an economy where capitalism, free markets, enterprise and ambition have been replaced and are often crushed by a modern form of corporatism, which is supported by all three political parties and the trade union movement.”


- http://www.cityam.com/209322/ukips-nige ... ms-economy

Also:

Quote:
- A Britain that is more than just a star on someone else’s flag.


- http://www.ukip.org/believe_in_britain_ ... ource=ukip

:-?

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 2:55 pm 
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Your post surprises me for two reasons:

1. You are voting
2. You are voting for UKIP, you racist son of a bitch.

:))

Do appreciate you're voting UKIP for reasons other than immigration (I presume), but do you think the reasoning behind your vote will be lost in what they're really about?

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 3:09 pm 
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Holyman wrote:
Yup.
Got to get rid of "First Past the Post".


Just a simple system of Proportional Representation will do me.

Also party funding should not be by donation but taken from tax. The figures involved are relatively minor and partially breaks the bond between political parties and big business/unions/rich sons of bitches.

Also need real-time publication of income and claimed expenses available on the internet of all MPs.

How do we stop politics being dominated by Oxbridge toffs though?

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:07 pm 
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Slacks wrote:
Your post surprises me for two reasons:

1. You are voting
2. You are voting for UKIP, you racist son of a bitch.

:))

Do appreciate you're voting UKIP for reasons other than immigration (I presume), but do you think the reasoning behind your vote will be lost in what they're really about?


Well…

I’m going to vote this year ‘cos I think 2015 is going to be a “Special” Election.

After 25 years of living in staunch Conservative constituencies, where any vote I might have cast would have made precisely zero difference to any outcome anywhere… 2015 is shaping up to be the year that the Two-Party, First-Past-the-Post System finally fractures.

I mean, let’s not forget that we’ve had to have a Coalition (in name, at least) Government for the past five years, ‘cos no one party was strong enough to even get “Past the Post”. This year, with the fall-out from the Scottish Devolution campaign, UKIP on the March, Lib Dem’s evaporating and none of their votes likely to go Tory or Labour, and any number of other Single Issue and “Fringe” candidates… The chances of any one Party producing anything like a workable majority are next to zero.

Fuck’s sake, even senior Tories are putting out the feelers for a Conservative-Labour Coalition, of all things.

So, worth voting this year, just to make sure that a vote that *ISN’T* for the Tories or Labour is recorded.

As for why I’m looking at UKIP…

Well, it really was those two comments about the situation in Ukraine (and elsewhere), and the situation with Corporatism in Politics that twigged my radar.

Then I started thinking…

How do I know that UKIP is a bunch of mental, eccentric, bigoted fascists..?

And I realised that I could only answer that honestly by saying: because that is what the Media and Mainstream Politicians have told me.

And it does kind of make sense, given the threat posed by UKIP candidates in many marginal constituencies, that the Conservatives and Labour would do their best to discredit UKIP as a viable threat.

Here’s what UKIP actually has to say about immigration:

Quote:
Controlling and managing our borders

– UKIP recognises the benefits of limited, controlled immigration.
– UKIP will leave the EU, and take back control of our borders. Work permits will be permitted to fill skills gaps in the UK jobs market.
– We will extend to EU citizens the existing points-based system for time-limited work permits. Those coming to work in the UK must have a job to go to, must speak English, must have accommodation agreed prior to their arrival, and must have NHS-approved health insurance.
– Migrants will only be eligible for benefits (in work or out of work) when they have been paying tax and NI for five years and will only be eligible for permanent residence after ten years.
– UKIP will reinstate the primary purpose rule for bringing foreign spouses and children to the UK.
– UKIP will not offer an amnesty for illegal immigrants or those gaining British passports through fraud.
– UKIP will return to the principles of the UN Convention of Refugees which serves to protect the most vulnerable.


As you know, I’m a One World kind of a guy, who thinks that all National borders should (and will) be abolished.

So I don’t support any aspect of UKIP’s stance on immigration: personally, I’d eradicate the UK’s borders altogether, and look after anyone who came to stay.

But…

There’s no chance that UKIP will form a government following the 2015 General Election. So I’m not at all concerned that a UKIP government will institute an immigration policy that I find objectionable… This year.

Also…

Though I don’t agree with any of UKIP’s Immigration Policy, I can’t say I find any of it irrational or unreasonable, in the same way as, say, that of the BNP.

Quote:
- Deport all the two million plus who are here illegally;
- Deport all those who commit crimes and whose original nationality was not British;
- Review all recent grants of residence or citizenship to ensure they are still appropriate;
- Offer generous grants to those of foreign descent resident here who wish to leave permanently;
- Stop all new immigration except for exceptional cases;
- Reject all asylum seekers who passed safe countries on their way to Britain.



And also…

I’ve long railed against the absurdity of parcelling up the myriad of Social, Economic and Diplomatic policies, and sharing them out amongst the Blue, Red, Yellow, and now Green and Purple Parties.

I don’t agree with UKIP’s policies on Immigration. And I *REALLY* don’t agree with the Conservative and Labour Party policies on Nuclear “Defence” *OR* continued N.A.T.O. Membership.

At least the BNP (and possibly UKIP) are only nasty to those foreigners who make it to the U.K. The Tories and Labour seem to support the concept of killing foreigners in their own countries..!

Point being, that whilst UKIP does have that one aspect of their manifesto I find objectionable, they also have other policies:

Quote:
Repairing the UK Economy

– UKIP will increase personal allowance to the level of full-time minimum wage earnings (approx £13,500 by next election).
– Inheritance tax will be abolished.
– We will introduce a 35p income tax rate between £42,285 and £55,000, whereupon the 40p rate becomes payable.
– UKIP will set up a Treasury Commission to design a turnover tax to ensure big businesses pay a minimum floor rate of tax as a proportion of their UK turnover.


That last point being a vast improvement over anything the Tories or Labour are suggesting.

Quote:
The National Health Service

– UKIP will ensure the NHS is free at the point of delivery and time of need for all UK residents.
– We will stop further use of PFI in the NHS and encourage local authorities to buy out their PFI contracts early where this is affordable.
– We will ensure that GPs’ surgeries are open at least one evening per week, where there is demand for it.
– UKIP opposes plans to charge patients for visiting their GP.


Who’d have thunk it? A British political party that is actually proud of the NHS..!

Quote:
Democracy and the Constitution

– UKIP will overcome the unfairness of MPs from devolved nations voting on English-only issues.
– UKIP supports the recall of MPs as was originally promised in the Coalition Agreement, whereby 20% of the electorate in a constituency must sign a recall petition within eight weeks. The approval of MPs will not be required to initiate a recall petition.
– UKIP will introduce the Citizens’ Initiative to allow the public to initiate national referendums on issues of major public interest.


Sounds like fun!

Quote:
Employment and Small Businesses

– Businesses should be able to discriminate in favour of young British workers.


Actually…

Now that I come to think of it…

I probably *WON’T* vote UKIP…

But my point still stands: I should decide for myself who the reactionary fascist bastards are..!

>>::$

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:13 pm 
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Find it fucking bizarre that a party that wants to slice off England can be involved in English issues.
Its like letting me operate the soundboard of a Coldplay concert.
"This is a customer information announcement, you are all cunts, I repeat, all whiney cunts. For your own safety and sanity you should leave by the nearest exit immediately. Oh you are? Thats because youre a pathetic little cunt who likes Coldplay......" (enjoyed writing that waaay too much).

Kinda like Faraaage, makes decent, pertinent points. Like him and a select few in the chamber just to shake it up and get the status quo challenged.
His lieutenants and below are generally cunts and those who vote for him wankers though.

Used to always be Liberal, and liked Nick Clegg (oh my giddy aunt roflmao!!), liked the idea of having a third major party in there to increase the debate and spread the bullshit a bit.
I pretty much think (and sadly, hope), they all but disintegrate into shameful nothingness. Seriously nothing. Fuck off. Total squandering of opportunity and batting as the other side's bitch cannot be forgiven in high office.
Imagine the 'ginger haired rodent' having a chinwag with Putin? Really?
Fuck off.

Not sure of the solution, but proportional representation seems a democratic fundamental to me.
A few toffs in Haslemere having equivalent seats to a hundred thousand average types in Portsmouth seems to be completely fucked up. One vote here is worth 20 votes there? Wut?


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:16 pm 
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Your vote doesn't count anymore Wunder.

Not since you let Slacks beat you up in his dreams.

Sorry.

:-??

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:18 pm 
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Just read that shit.

In his dreams. Know what I mean? :P


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 4:47 pm 
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Well he's never managed to beat me up, even in his dreams.

Is all I'm saying.

:-"

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 5:02 pm 
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I've not even beaten SomeGuy in my dreams.

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 6:33 pm 
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vote UKIP and see the NHS get privatized - or is that just a media slander?

HM have you fallen prey to the classic political move of a political leader getting your support by grandstanding on an emotional issue that ultimately has little to do with your daily life (eu encroachment on the Ukraine) while they rob you blind?


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 7:49 pm 
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geronimo95 wrote:
HM have you fallen prey to the classic political move of a political leader getting your support by grandstanding on an emotional issue that ultimately has little to do with your daily life (eu encroachment on the Ukraine) while they rob you blind?


Might have been a close run thing.

I think what I did fall prey to was identifying with a few critical points - Ukraine, Corporatism - and using those to overlook a few others...

But then, we're supposed to do that with the Red and the Blue parties, so I figured it didn't matter too much if that was the approach I took with the Purple party: particularly since there is no chance that the Purple party will form the next Government.

I do stand by the point that I was only rejecting UKIP because of all the propaganda. *NOW* I reject them because I've weighed up their manifesto and found that, on balance, they are reactionary arseholes who want to turn back time.

Which is an altogether more solid rejection.

:-bd

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 11:31 pm 
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This thread makes me realize how clueless I am about British politics. FFS, I thought Tony Blair was still in charge.

[**==]


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:03 am 
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Well surely you know the Canadian PM...I mean that's common knowledge throughout the international community right?

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 3:14 am 
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Slacks wrote:
I've not even beaten SomeGuy in my dreams.


Strike at me in your dreams and you best wake up and apologize.

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:34 am 
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25th Soldier Select wrote:
This thread makes me realize how clueless I am about British politics. FFS, I thought Tony Blair was still in charge.


Tony Bliar is electoral poison these days.

Hell, even candidates from his old Party won't accept donations from him:

Quote:
Scottish Labour candidate rejects £1,000 donation from Tony Blair

Lesley Brennan, standing in Dundee East, refused her portion of a six-figure donation to the national party by the former Labour leader


http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... tony-blair

The publication of the Chilcot Report into Britain's role in the Iraq War is being politically withheld until after the General Election. When and *IF* it ever does get published, it is likely that Mr. Blair will find himself in very hot water...

>*^*<

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:50 am 
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Was thinking...

Is UKIP like the Jeremy Clarkson of Political Parties..?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/celebri ... dules.html

Quote:
Jeremy Clarkson suspended: BBC refuses to say if Top Gear will ever return after it is pulled from schedules

Jeremy Clarkson's suspension over a "fracas" with a Top Gear producer throws future of BBC's most successful programme into doubt


Obnoxious, reactionary, mostly ignorant, totally unreconstructed, shockingly bigoted...

...But identifiably, eccentrically and entertainingly English.

:-?

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:16 pm 
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He's alleged to have punched one of the producers. Despite this there is a petition of 300,000 (so far) to reinstate him.

He's sometimes funny. I have a problem with Top Gear as a whole in that it's a bit shit these days. I don't mind silly, clearly staged challenges, as long as it involves exotic cars and not completely outrageous humour. Seeing if they can build their own electric car or drop-top people carrier is highly naff and contrived.

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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:24 pm 
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Familiarity breeds contempt I suppose.

I think Richard Hammond's tweet (following Clarkson's suspension) summed it up:

"If the BBC screens 'Last of the Summer Wine' instead of Top Gear: will anyone notice the difference?"

Can imagine that May and Hammond must be getting a bit cheesed off with Clarkson's antics...

:-??

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 5:17 pm 
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Slacks wrote:
He's alleged to have punched one of the producers. Despite this there is a petition of 300,000 (so far) to reinstate him.

He's sometimes funny. I have a problem with Top Gear as a whole in that it's a bit shit these days. I don't mind silly, clearly staged challenges, as long as it involves exotic cars and not completely outrageous humour. Seeing if they can build their own electric car or drop-top people carrier is highly naff and contrived.


those stupid challenges like build a boatcar are the only part of top gear i find entertaining. not a car guy so watching those 3 guys cream their pants over hp or torque or whatever is pretty boring.


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:07 pm 
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I did cream my pants the other week watching Gillian Anderson be the Star in the Reasonably Priced Car.

All those years avidly watching "The X-Files", and I never realised she was English...

>&8~

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:36 pm 
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gillian_Anderson

born in chicago?


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 6:46 pm 
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Not just English... A North Londoner..! Crouch End... Stone's throw from me.

Well... Alright... Apparently she is "Bidialectal", which means she is capable of fluently and natively speaking in two different accents.

She chose a North London twang for her Top Gear appearance, and that's how I'll always hear her from now on!

:x

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"To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty, but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places—and there are so many—where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don’t have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvellous victory." - Howard Zinn


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:37 pm 
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First Sergeant
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looking at her bio. she was born in the states and holds an american passport. granted she did live in london for a few years as a kid but she is american


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 Post subject: Re: UK Election 2015
PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2015 9:11 am 
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Holyman
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geronimo95 wrote:
Granted she did live in london for a few years as a kid but she is american


Which makes her a Londoner.

She can speak Londonish; therefore she is a Londoner.

Actually...

Just realised after living here for 20 years, that "London" is one of those words that doesn't sound right, the more you keep saying it... Particularly once you start conjugating it...

No matter.

Scully sounds like she is from London: the Truth is now out there!

:-bd

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