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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:10 pm 
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Entertaining theatre!
:-?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:22 am 
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Slacks wrote:
Seeing as it was pretty clear the vote wouldn't have gone her way some time ago, maybe this is all part of her master plan to go back to Brussels and say 'need moar consessions or hard Brexit and Corbyn'. Or is that giving her too much credit? Just seems odd she's been try to flog this dead horse and appearing completely detached from reality.


I think History will be kind to Theresa May.

She has been in a difficult position from the moment she took up post as Prime Minister; she has been very poorly advised subsequently; and her position has become all but impossible now.

But up until yesterday morning’s European Court ruling on Article 50, there was no clear alternative to May’s stalwart attempts to try to appease so many conflicting interests.

That’s the sense I get about Theresa May: she is just someone who will not walk away from a problem she has taken responsibility for resolving. Which sounds great on paper, but *IS* based on the conviction that there simply is nobody else who could do a better job than she can.

The reason why she isn’t getting any sympathy, is because she is very clearly putting the interests of her own political party ahead of the interests of the U.K. and the E.U.

The original referendum only happened because of squabbling within Conservative Party factions. The Referendum Campaign broadcast the divisions in the Tory Party loud and wide. And it is Tory MP’s who are functioning as the most effective Opposition Government in Parliament.

Meanwhile… People in the U.K. and other E.U. nations are being held hostage to U.K. Conservative Party factionalism.

From a business/commercial perspective…

…If everything is going to change on March 29th, 2019, companies need to start making preparations. But this is not possible because negotiations have been so unproductive.

And negotiations have been so unproductive because the U.K. Conservative Party has not been able to agree on a coherent, realistic and stable negotiating position.

It would be unfair to put all of the blame on Theresa May, when it should be placed fairly and equally on the entire Tory Party.

They should all resign in shame.

^^|^^

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:08 am 
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Yeah agree with all that.

Meanwhile Juncker keeps the door open on further negoti....

Juncker wrote:
There is no room for renegotiation


Well I guess that's that then.


Gotta love this tweet from an MEP:

"Now you want to renegotiate your own proposal?! It’s relatively difficult for us in our not very well developed intellectual thinking to understand that.”

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:43 pm 
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Was catching Holywoman up on the latest Brexit machinations last night, and something tumbled out of my mind that either fits in this thread, or in the “European Spring” thread… (Or probably both.)

Neoliberalism is dead.

Call it “Thatcherism”, “Reaganomics”, “Trickle-Down”… Whatever…

The idea that Governments exist to get themselves out of the way…

phpBB [video]


Or that there is no such thing as “Society”…

…Just doesn’t seem to have caught the imagination of the Public.

I’m not saying Reagan or Thatcher were “wrong” in their opinions and policies… Everyone is entitled to think their own thoughts…

Just saying that “Trickle-Down”/”Supply-Side” Economics hasn’t worked out for most people… As far as those People are concerned.

They’ve been told not to expect or feel entitled to “hand-outs” from “their” Government… All the while watching trillions in subsidies, corporate welfare and tax-cuts being freely handed out to those who appear least in need, and/or least deserving.

That’s a really important point that our OP Capitalista’s should bear in mind before wading in with their usual tropes.

People aren’t complaining about not getting “welfare”, hand-outs or higher “Minimum Wages”, just because they’re never happy… They are complaining about the fact that whilst they are being told not to expect anything, corporations and the ultra-wealthy *ARE* being given whatever they request.

If the kind of “Free Market”, Libertarian, laissez-faire policies favoured by the followers of Ayn Rand were actually in effect and being applied universally, without fear or favour…

…Then most of the major investment banks in Western Society would have collapsed in 2008.

And all of the debt owed to those institutions could have vanished along with them.

But instead of writing-down (or cancelling) the over-priced priced debt products (euphemistically called “Credit”) that so many people were enticed into, Western Governments bailed out the institutions that had done the enticing, so that the enticers could go on collecting on those odious debts.

Why is it that people are so quick to pounce on “Welfare Queens”, “Entitled” Public Sector Unions, and other general, Street-Level scroungers… But never have a word to say about the billions and trillions in corporate welfare payments given without question (and often, before even being asked)?

The complaint being expressed in European cities (and spreading) is not, “We want more!”; but “Stop giving it all to them!”.

President Trump has done Humanity a sterling service by exposing the naked, rancid corruption at the heart of (all) “Politics”.

He hasn’t done and won’t do anything personally to “Drain the Swamp”, Creature-of-the-Swamp that he himself is… But he is sure as shit doing a magnificent job of exposing the Swamp in all its cynical and moribund glory.

Western Governments are so afraid that the Game is (Finally!) Up, that they are even trying to start World War Three with Russia and/or China, as a means to distract their polities from the appalling corruption of their politicians.

But nobody’s buying that either.

They’re not interested in any more “spin”. They’re not interested in any more platitudes or reassurances that “Everything is Going to Be Great Again (Soon…)!”, when Everything is getting so palpably worse.

So here’s the reason why I’ve opted to put this post in the MBGA Thread:

A UK Government led by Jeremy Corbyn would/will be the final nail in the coffin of Neoliberalism.

A Corbyn Government would/will reverse all of the “privatisations [sic]” and part-privatisations (profits = private; losses = public) that have taken place since Thatcher started “selling off the Family Silver”. And unfortunately for all the Neoliberal cheerleaders of “Private Sector ‘Efficiencies’”, those “privatised” and part-privatised infrastructure services, cannot possibly *BE* run any less efficiently than they are under current arrangements.

(Re-)Nationalisation of the UK’s rail, water and energy infrastructures would immediately improve the daily Life experience of most Brits, and would prohibit any future attempts at privatisation.

Corbyn’s Chancellor, John McDonnell, might even go as far as nationalising the UK Banking Sector, which would *MASSIVELY* transform UK Society, in ways that most people can scarcely comprehend.

And any ideological opposition to a Corbyn Government doing that, would have to deal with the obvious evidence of the failure of 40 years of “Supply-Side”, Neoliberal Economic policies.

And that’s really the crux of the matter:

Forty years of meek acceptance that “Things Can Only Get Better”, culminating in ten years of “Austerity” (for those without political influence), has provided ample evidence that “Supply-Side” Economic Policy has been an abject failure (who’da thunk it?).

The “Fear” of another “Winter of Discontent” and/or a return of the ”Three-Day Week” has long since lost its sting.

The cry on the Street is, “How could things *BE* any worse than they are now?!”

If Theresa May doesn’t manage to cling on to her increasingly tenuous position, and the UK Labour Party moves from its position of “Strategic Ambiguity” on Brexit, to offering a Second Referendum with a now viable “Cancel Brexit” option, in any General Election manifesto…

Labour wins that General Election by a landslide.

And the UK Conservative Party fractures, and never, ever, ever forms a British Government again.

Which is about the only way that the last two years in British politics won’t have been a complete waste of Time and Energy.

>&8~

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:05 am 
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Vote of no confidence in Theresa May to happen TODAY.

https://news.sky.com/story/live-may-on- ... e-11578479

I suspect she'll survive because the alternatives are too scary for most Tories, but it's a bit of a blow when there's enough people wanting you out to warrant a no confidence vote.

>*^*<

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:26 am 
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Interesting PMQs today?

I'd be glad for a proper Brexiteer (Mogg, BoJo or Davis) to take over, do the thing and hand over the mantle to another vote. Fuck sake.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:33 am 
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BoJo isn't a 'proper Brexiteer', he adopts whatever policy suits his ambitions. Davis is useless. Raab said he hadn't understood the importance of the Dover - Calais crossing for trade.

I loathe Mogg but he's like Ronseal - he does exactly what he says on the tin and has done for years - so I'd rather have him.

That being said none of the Brexiteers would get a hard Brexit through Parliament unless they forced a no-deal, which would destroy their legacy and the Tory party even more, and would quickly be replaced with a deal by the successor government anyway.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:11 am 
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If the Conservative Party had anything like the honour and integrity they insist they have, they would *ALL* resign in disgrace, and offer profound apologies to the British and European people for this whole sorry shit show.

>&8~

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:16 am 
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They need to splash some of this on at the next negotiation.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:52 am 
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Pound climbs as Theresa May vows to fight vote of no confidence

The Market has spoken.

:-h

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:01 am 
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Holyman wrote:


Because a 2nd ref is now more likely?

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:27 pm 
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That too, I suppose.

But mostly it's The Market's way of saying it supports the motion of no confidence in the current UK Prime Minister.

May, you live in Interesting Times.

>*^*<

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:46 pm 
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May has reportedly told the cabinet she won't stand in the next election as PM, so I guess she'll be quitting once her withdrawal plan succeeds or more likely fails.

No real surprise.

I guess she might quit shortly if her win tonight is not of a decent size.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:14 pm 
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RESULTS WITHIN THE HOUR.

Not actually that exciting or unpredictable, but hey.

Murrica should have votes of no confidence.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:58 pm 
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She's a goner.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:00 pm 
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Vote for confidence III/O

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:06 pm 
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200 votes for, 117 against. A win, but not a particularly convincing one.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:09 pm 
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Slacks wrote:
200 votes for, 117 against. A win, but not a particularly convincing one.


Much like Brexit itself.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:23 pm 
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PBFMullethunter wrote:
Slacks wrote:
200 votes for, 117 against. A win, but not a particularly convincing one.


Much like Brexit itself.


Why it's almost as if a little over half the voters asking a Parliament that's 73% pro-remain was never going to go well. Who'd have thought it!

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:28 pm 
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The good news is that Britain is very small and, in the grand scheme of things, rather insignificant.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:38 pm 
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PBFMullethunter wrote:
The good news is that Britain is very small and, in the grand scheme of things, rather insignificant.


*Splutter* 5th largest economy I'll have you know. I've lost count of the number of countries knocking down our doors for trade deals. But then I can't count too good.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:18 pm 
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Slacks wrote:
PBFMullethunter wrote:
The good news is that Britain is very small and, in the grand scheme of things, rather insignificant.


*Splutter* 5th largest economy I'll have you know.



I think you just lost that position...

... to India.

>*^*<


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 7:59 am 
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PBFMullethunter wrote:
Slacks wrote:
PBFMullethunter wrote:
The good news is that Britain is very small and, in the grand scheme of things, rather insignificant.


*Splutter* 5th largest economy I'll have you know.



I think you just lost that position...

... to India.

>*^*<


They're part of our empire.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:11 am 
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MH is just jealous because Canada was never the Jewel in the Crown of the British Empire.

(Situation is currently vacant however, with the Isle of Man just serving as a placeholder atm.)

:-S

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 1:00 pm 
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Seems the yellow vest thing is catching, with brexiters blocking a bridge in London.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/b ... o-13733051

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