Have we decided what the question is yet? Could be a long thread otherwise.
OK, I’ve been giving this some thought.
I’m a “Right On” Pacifist, aren’t I? Yes… I think I am…
Therefore: *ANY* powerful, bullying individual or group of individuals who adopt and implement any policies that purposely cause pain and suffering to any other group of individuals is something I must automatically object to.
Doesn’t matter if the individuals or governments dishing out the pain and suffering are Israeli, Saudi, Iranian, Chinese, American, Russian, Congolese, Indonesian, Chinese, North Korean… Whatever.
It would be hypocritical of me to criticise the Israeli Government for its treatment of Palestinians, whilst simultaneously excusing other governments for treating other populations so horrifically.
So I don’t.
Of course, the absence of expressed criticism in no way equals an attempt to excuse.
It’s quite simple: they’re all bastards.
Individual human beings who rise to positions of social, political and economic power, rarely escape the clutches of bastardy.
All of them.
Every president, prime minister, king, queen, dictator, Blue-Chip CEO, religious potentate and any other human being in a position of power and influence who feels that their primary objective is to increase their own power and influence at anyone and everyone else’s expense.
And when they decide that other human beings must die, in order to Make The World A Better Place, they take their place in the hardly-exclusive club of humans throughout History who lack the imagination to come up with anything other than violence to promote their beliefs.
All bastards. All of them.
Every single example you have listed Foota. Unequivocally: bastards.
We were of course engaged in a discussion to rank who the biggest bastards are (or were), and which selected group of human beings in History has suffered the most.
But I say: they’re all bastards; and trying to rank who has suffered the most, out of all the suffering ever inflicted on human beings by other, bastard human beings, is pointless.
All of them bastards.
That’s my position, isn’t it Foota?
But not your position…
Your position is that some of those bastards are okay.
You believe that in certain circumstances, it is entirely necessary to behave like a bastard towards other human beings.
In fact, you routinely (inevitably and predictably) support the Governments of Israel and the United States of America (and of late, Saudi Arabia…). Currently the biggest bastards on the Planet, actively engaged in destroying sovereign nations, oppressing and causing the deaths of local populations, and generally keeping the whole World on a hair-trigger away from all out (and final) War.
And you support them Foota.
You support several groups of human beings who think that it is right and proper to deliberately kill other human beings.
I might think that what the Chinese Government is doing to Chinese Uighurs is “not as bad” as what the Israeli Government is doing to the Palestinians….
But like I said: that’s an irrelevance. The Chinese Government bullies and oppresses people; the Israeli Government bullies and oppresses people.
What’s the point in even considering which is the greater bully?
Acknowledging “We’re bad; but *THEY* are worse!” doesn’t cut it anymore. Not in the 21st Century. Personal Responsibility is the “New Thing”.
Kicking the shit out of people whilst pointing at someone else who might arguably be kicking more shit out of more people in worse way, only works on Nationalists.
If you’re not a Nationalist (and obviously I’m not), you just see one group of human beings kicking the shit out of another group, just as unnecessarily and counter-productively as all the other groups of human being who think that the way to get ahead is to drag everyone else back.
I think the actual question here is:”Since the United States has tried to justify its illegal and devastating invasions of other nations on the basis of allegations about the way the target nations’ governments are oppressing their people; can the U.S. seriously maintain any credibility when it refuses to criticise Israel, or support Canada in its criticisms of Saudi Arabia?”
(Feel free to substitute “Foota” for “the United States/U.S.”.)